Hey guys, NEED HELP

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Joachim
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:35 pm

geert pardon wrote:Strange, my fuses are on the right side (if you stand behind the bike) near the cdi box and not on the side of the battery.



Hi Geert. You are a proud owner of a CX???
Congratulations ;)

giggle Joachim
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Fri Jul 13, 2012 10:17 pm

geert pardon wrote:Strange, my fuses are on the right side (if you stand behind the bike) near the cdi box and not on the side of the battery.
Gileragreetings....geert


hi there, you are right but once i made the wiring i pulled to inside of the black box where the battery is, its more protected :)

here is a pic to show you... this is not my moto :P its from a friend in PT and just for reference.
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:27 pm

I just had a look at the ignition switch of my GFR.
Seems that Luigi has changed a lot on this :(
The plug at the end of the cable has 5 wires and an extra one.

I found another switch which i don't know where it's from. But it must be a Gilera one.
I think it is out of the spare parts box which cam with one of my GFRs.
The plug has only 3 wires and an extra one. So this one could b more like that you are lookin for.
But the switch itself has solder pads no contacts for cable shoes like yours.
Sorry, that's all i can find out :(

Pics of the 4 wires switch and plug.
ZuendschlossGilera.jpg

KabelGilera1.jpg

KabelGilera2.jpg


Pics of the GFR plug
KabelGFR1.jpg

KabelGFR2.jpg
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Sun Jul 15, 2012 8:25 pm

Joachim wrote:I just had a look at the ignition switch of my GFR.
Seems that Luigi has changed a lot on this :(
The plug at the end of the cable has 5 wires and an extra one.

I found another switch which i don't know where it's from. But it must be a Gilera one.
I think it is out of the spare parts box which cam with one of my GFRs.
The plug has only 3 wires and an extra one. So this one could b more like that you are lookin for.
But the switch itself has solder pads no contacts for cable shoes like yours.
Sorry, that's all i can find out :(

Pics of the 4 wires switch and plug.


Thanks Joachim, unfortunately i cant clean my doubt.
both examples you gave shows different solutions and in both cases, it doesnt look original... or similar to CX.
Geert should say something, maybe after looking to your pics he may give some idea.
There is not even CX owner except me and my 2 other friends? :oops:

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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby geert pardon » Mon Jul 16, 2012 5:11 pm

I know Gottfried had one (although I think it's sold)
You can try to send him an e-mail but be patient, sometimes he have problems with his health.
but he should know more about 2-takt.

Other solution is the French Gilera site, and ask there.
Gileragreetings....geert

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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Mon Jul 16, 2012 7:58 pm

Hi

as is *know* that my 3 ignition switches (look all thesame) are from Gilera, it might be that yours are not ;)
Gottfried is not a good source at the moment.
He did not answer on 2 emails. And somebody else asked me if i did know why he did not answer on his mails.
So don't expect to much at the moment.
But our fomous Forum admin Bjoern has a CX ;)
Maybe he is reading this.

good luck, Joachim
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Mon Jul 16, 2012 9:38 pm

Joachim wrote:Hi

as is *know* that my 3 ignition switches (look all thesame) are from Gilera, it might be that yours are not ;)
Gottfried is not a good source at the moment.
He did not answer on 2 emails. And somebody else asked me if i did know why he did not answer on his mails.
So don't expect to much at the moment.
But our fomous Forum admin Bjoern has a CX ;)
Maybe he is reading this.

good luck, Joachim



Thanks guys.
I guess you are right but the truth is that the color of the wirings are not the same has the diagram and not the same number, so, for me, doesnt look original :S

maybe you are right when you say that they were changed and adjusted since the first plans like the diagram i have presented here.

But maybe, my REAL problem can be other.

:?: If I tell you that i have NO spark from the spark module but: :?:

the module is working in another moto
and the shoke from impulsator/magneto gets to the module...

Why I DONT HAVE spark??? *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh*

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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:27 pm

If everything is working and you still have no spark,
maybe someone is switching your spark to ground.
The kill-switch or the ignition switch do things like this ;)
Also a broken wire which touches the frame.
The ignition system of those little Gilera is a CDI system. Both parts, the main electric and the ignition are working (nearly) separated.
From the charging coil under the side cover of the engine there is a blue wire (yes i know) routed to the HT coil. The coil has two plugs, one small and one wider.
Last one is the one with the blue wire (or whatever the colour is at yours) from the charging coil.
At this wire there is a y-piece. One wire wents to the HTcoil the other to the front of the bike.
This is the wire where the ignition switch, the kill switch and also the rev counter (suppode you have the electric one) are connected.
If you plug of this connector right by the coil you have separated the ignition circuit from the rest of the electric.
If you have troubble shortcutting the ignition energy, now you should have a spark ;)
Then you know where to search.

Have you checked everything for propper ground connection?
Paint jobs, specially powder coating and fixing parts with anodised Aluminium bolts sometimes cause funny problems ;)
You may put an Ohm meter between the mountin point on the HT coil and the ground pole at your batterie. You should read something like zero.
Same at the mountig point under your side cover of the engine where all the coils are located.
There are green wires at the charging coil and also at the pick up coil.
Measure to batterie ground.
In the workshop maual there are some datas to the electric (HT coil, charging coil and pick-up)
Measure and compare.

Good luck ;)

ciao joachim
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JFK3_3
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 2:45 pm

Joachim wrote:If everything is working and you still have no spark,
maybe someone is switching your spark to ground.
The kill-switch or the ignition switch do things like this ;)
Also a broken wire which touches the frame.
The ignition system of those little Gilera is a CDI system. Both parts, the main electric and the ignition are working (nearly) separated.
From the charging coil under the side cover of the engine there is a blue wire (yes i know) routed to the HT coil. The coil has two plugs, one small and one wider.
Last one is the one with the blue wire (or whatever the colour is at yours) from the charging coil.
At this wire there is a y-piece. One wire wents to the HTcoil the other to the front of the bike.
This is the wire where the ignition switch, the kill switch and also the rev counter (suppode you have the electric one) are connected.
If you plug of this connector right by the coil you have separated the ignition circuit from the rest of the electric.
If you have troubble shortcutting the ignition energy, now you should have a spark ;)
Then you know where to search.

Have you checked everything for propper ground connection?
Paint jobs, specially powder coating and fixing parts with anodised Aluminium bolts sometimes cause funny problems ;)
You may put an Ohm meter between the mountin point on the HT coil and the ground pole at your batterie. You should read something like zero.
Same at the mountig point under your side cover of the engine where all the coils are located.
There are green wires at the charging coil and also at the pick up coil.
Measure to batterie ground.
In the workshop maual there are some datas to the electric (HT coil, charging coil and pick-up)
Measure and compare.

Good luck ;)

ciao joachim


Ciao Joachim,
I have sent PM but here is the photo that i toke today.
This shows the real picture of my chaos.
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 2:48 pm

believe it or not, this was almost ready...
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Wed Jul 18, 2012 5:35 pm

hmm... the way you connect electrical wires did not look very reliable ;)
I will send you pictures of an original Gilera ignition to compare.
I think we should start from the scratch ;)

ciao joachim

BTW again. Those two black boxes are the controllers of the electrical APTS system. They have nothing to do with the ignition. Put them somewhere else and don't care about them before your ignition fires up :)
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby JFK3_3 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 1:36 pm

Joachim wrote:hmm... the way you connect electrical wires did not look very reliable ;)
I will send you pictures of an original Gilera ignition to compare.
I think we should start from the scratch ;)

ciao joachim

BTW again. Those two black boxes are the controllers of the electrical APTS system. They have nothing to do with the ignition. Put them somewhere else and don't care about them before your ignition fires up :)


i new suggestion was presented to me from a spanish friend. i was trying to connect the engine WITHOUT the clocks and oil level connected in to the electrical system.
he suggested that the system only works with all stuff connected and the clocks are crucial for the balance of the electrical system, and maybe i could have another problem in the clocks, and this for sure could give the wrong results.
He present his suggestion:
Connect the oil level to the system
install and connect the clocks.
try to see if module gives spark.
make a small test to check if clocks are ok, putting neutral gear and at same time see if the oil level indicator flashes in the clocks.
result: everything looks fine. I have oil level light ON and NEUTRAL light on at same time.
unfortunately,,, NO SPARK!!! *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh* *durchdreh*
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby Joachim » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:30 pm

oil level and neutral together is ok.
The oil level light wents off when pou put a gear in.
Thats a special service from Luigi for you to check if the light is still ok :wink:
Im not shure that the lights and clocks have any influence on the ignition.
See your wiring sheme.
The alternator only has this 2 wires connected to the ignition, blue and black.
As said before, the blue one ist also connected to the ignition switch, engine stop (kill switch) and the tacho (that should be the rev counter, but i think thats the rev counter in english)
Plug off this connector and your ignition is a stand alone system.

ciao Joachim <will be back at home for further measurements tomorrow>
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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby fredie » Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:17 pm

hello . sorry to see your bike not running sparking . i will help if i can *thumb*

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Re: Hey guys, NEED HELP

Postby hahne » Sun Oct 14, 2012 9:09 pm

My OLD Mail WAS hahne.power@t-online.de ...now without function!!

New mail: hahne.power@gmx.de!!!!!!!!

Bye Gottfried


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